Obama: A different kind of dirty

The Democratic Party came to the wrong conclusion yesterday. What they did was wholly UNdemocratic. How can anyone, especially if they live in Florida or Michigan, ever have faith in that party again? It's bad enough that the Republicans shit on Florida in 2000, but now the Democrats have shit on them in 2008. This is not good for the country.

The problems with the Florida primary were entirely caused by Republicans. Everything else about their primary was legitimate. The only fair thing to do was to have re-instated Florida's delegates fully as if the primary had happened in March. The Democratic Party did not do this.

The problems with Michigan were caused by the Democrats themselves. They should not have given Iowa and New Hampshire any more preference over any other states in scheduling their primaries. Additionally, all of the candidates besides Clinton chose to have their names removed from the ballots, and they paid for lawyers to have this done. The only fair thing to do is to give Clinton all the delegates she earned, and allow the remaining delegates to go to the convention as "uncommitted", exactly as the ballot showed. This was, after all, the intent of the remaining candidates. The Democratic Party did not do this.

When the Constitution was adopted, it treated black people as 3/5 of a person--not a whole person--just 60 of a person. This, of course, was wrong and took nearly 100 years, a Constitutional Amendment, and the costliest war in American history to remedy. What kind of message does it say to voters when the Democratic Party says "Your vote is worth only half on account of where you live, but everyone else gets a full vote"? How is this different than saying "You're only counted as 3/5 of a person due to your skin color, but everyone else gets counted as a whole person"? What part of fair and democratic voting does the party not understand?

One of the things they did was take four delegates away from Clinton (that she earned) and awarded them to Obama (he did not earn them). This had the effect of changing the votes of 600,000 people in Michigan. How is this democratic? How is this even legal? Of course this made a lot of people angry. It's the sort of thing that goes on in corrupt governments and dictatorships. It should never happen in the United States... but it has.

I can tell you now that there will be TV and radio advertisements in both states that say "The Democratic Party took your vote away. They don't want you to vote, and they don't care about you. Vote for McCain, instead. We care about you! We counted all of our votes. Paid for by the Republican Party." How is that going to help defeat the Republicans in November? It won't.

Here are some things that people at the meeting yesterday had to say about it:

"I am astonished that we have the gall and the chutzpah to substitute our judgment for 600,000 voters. Hijacking four delegates is not a good way to start down the path of party unity. Mrs. Clinton has instructed me to reserve her right to take this to the credentials committee." -- Harold Ickes, committee member

"Denver! Denver! Denver!" --Hecklers, booing the committee and the Obama supporters, suggesting the fight be taken to the National Convention

"The Democrats are throwing the election away. For what? An inadequate black male." -- Harriet Christian (New York)

(True, it had never occurred to me that he was "inadequate", but that is the best adjective to describe his experience and credentials.)

"This is outrageous to have four delegates just taken away. I don't feel like we have any voice in this party." -- Joan Lipkin (Missouri)

"The committee sold out to Obama. Obama gamed the system. That's the Obama game. He talks about new politics, but he plays dishonest politics." -- Lyn Forester de Rothschild (New York)

Yep. I've always been saying "Change? What change? Obama has never said what he plans to change to. He's doing the same thing as everyone else, but alienating those who would play the game on his side." People believe he's playing a new type of political game (and therefore a clean game), but it's just a different kind of dirty. At least with Clinton we know exactly what kind of mud there is and that we can fling it and win.

I believe that the Democratic Party chose (long ago) to have Obama as the candidate. Unfortunately, his chances of winning against McCain were slim before the RBC decision, and now they're slimmer. That McCain is the next president means that there will be no restoration of civil rights, no restoration of environmental policies, no attempt at universal health care. Rather, the opposite: health care will get more expensive, the government will break more laws, the environment will continue to be raped for a profit until it dies (taking us with it), and a nuclear war with Iran is statistical likelihood.

I've seen these kinds of political fraud happening on the news in communist countries, dictatorships, third-world countries where democracy is a joke and everyone knows that they don't have any real power there, but I never thought I would see these kinds of things in the United States. Then it happened in 2000 with the Republican Party... now it's happening in 2008 with the Democratic Party. Haven't we been habitually chastising those countries for the undemocratic elections? Nevertheless, we've turned into them. You know, for the first time ever, I truly feel doomed."



Display:


Very close (2.00 / 4)

It's hard to speculate now because anything can happen but I see no reason why the nation that chose Bush over Kerry (!) would pick Barack Obama over John McCain.  I think the Dem-leaning electorate in the primary has confused some Dems into thinking the General Election takes place in Sweden and France.  But it doesn't.  It's Ohio and Florida.  Loss for Obama and Loss for Obama.  


Lifelong Democrat, civil rights advocate, former volunteer for Dem candidates. Now Independent.
by BPK80 on Sun Jun 01, 2008 at 11:44:31 AM EST

Here you go (none / 0)


by JJE on Sun Jun 01, 2008 at 11:48:23 AM EST
[ Parent ]

very creative (2.00 / 2)

but man that guy needs help on the hat design, no?

Actually I don't think its a conspiracy...this is an unusal year and frankly anything can happen....!


by 4justice on Sun Jun 01, 2008 at 12:31:13 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Very close (none / 0)

It's not Ohio and Florida.  A win in NM, NV, and IA plus the Kerry states negates Ohio and Florida.  There are a bunch more combinations as well.

Even for Hillary, Ohio and Florida aren't important if she could really make KY, WV, AR, and TN competitive.

I'm tired of OH and Florida deciding elections for us.  they are not very reliable.  I'd rather expand the map with either candidate.  Before the next election, Ohio will lose at least 2, if not 3 electoral votes after the census.  Do you really want to continue to rely on such an unreliable, shrinking state?

The point is moot, anyways. Obama will win Ohio with Strickland's help, and Hillary wouldn't win Florida after McCain picks Christ as his running mare.


It profits a PUMA nothing to give their soul for the whole world... but for McCain? --Sir Thomas More (if he were here now)
by LordMike on Sun Jun 01, 2008 at 11:54:39 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Very close (1.50 / 2)

Obama won't win Ohio.  If Kerry couldn't do it, I see no reason to think Obama could.

Keep in mind your western state strategy must forget that we need to also offset the 4 EV's from New Hampshire that are going back to the GOP this fall (Kerry only penetrated there, barely, with Boston media market homestate advantage).  There is no room for error in the Obama perfect-chain-of-states EV strategy.  If one link breaks, the chain breaks.  


Lifelong Democrat, civil rights advocate, former volunteer for Dem candidates. Now Independent.
by BPK80 on Sun Jun 01, 2008 at 12:37:52 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Oh I forgot (none / 0)

the political situation in America hasn't changed AT ALL from 2004.

Kerry did better in Ohio than Bill ever did...thank God for Perot, right?


The American people; they were for the war before they were against it.
by nrafter530 on Sun Jun 01, 2008 at 01:52:33 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Very close (none / 0)

Kerry missed OH by less than 100,000 votes in an election run by corrupt republicans...  He will do just fine!


It profits a PUMA nothing to give their soul for the whole world... but for McCain? --Sir Thomas More (if he were here now)
by LordMike on Sun Jun 01, 2008 at 03:15:24 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Very close (none / 0)

Right.  Especially in those counties near Kentucky and West Virginia where he is so emininently popular.


Lifelong Democrat, civil rights advocate, former volunteer for Dem candidates. Now Independent.
by BPK80 on Mon Jun 02, 2008 at 07:14:59 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Historically close (2.00 / 1)

and with serious ramifications for our country. After this election, the democratic party will never be the same again.

Its an uphill climb for democrats from here, despite the year 2008 being a year when it should have been a cakewalk.  Obama has not convinced half the party, and that is added to the work of needing to convince America he really can lead this country.  

I think the transparency of the favoritism may be just the thing to spur the development of a viable third party, consisting of the dem coalition that was replaced by the Obama party.


by 4justice on Sun Jun 01, 2008 at 12:27:46 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Historically close (2.00 / 2)

Agreed.

I would not be so bothered by a "fair and square" loss.  30 memeber rules committees and bullying/bribing superdelegates doesn't cut it.


Lifelong Democrat, civil rights advocate, former volunteer for Dem candidates. Now Independent.
by BPK80 on Sun Jun 01, 2008 at 12:38:51 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Very close (none / 0)

And even Sweden and France, whose populations surely wish a Democratic president in the US, have recently elected right-of-center governments themselves.

Nothing is certain in the world of politics except that Obama is much weaker a candidate than his acolytes will ever accept.


Grumpy, reluctant, sore-losing, unhappy, irritable Hillary supporter for Barack Obama 2008
by DemAC on Sun Jun 01, 2008 at 01:30:14 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Very close (none / 0)

Agreed that the BO margin for error in the GE is razor thin, and the decision not to seat FL in full and to overturn the vote of 600,000 in MI seals the deal in those states. Welcome to President McCain.

People who criticize the Clinton supporters who objected loudly to the decision of the RBC yesterday lack an appreciation of history and any perspective on the ramifications of that crime against democracy. It is silence that is inappropriate and "impolite" to the millions who have died for freedom and democracy over generations, in the extreme. What happened yesterday was an international crime - election overturn by an elite political party inner circle, the stuff of bogus democracies and military coups. That so many are silent and/or dismissive of this event boggles the imagination, their passivity in the face of blatant destruction of voter's rights stomps on the face of every mortal sacrifice made in the name of democracy.

There will be no good end to this process given the trajectory it has taken. It is the politics of "change" that no one can believe in, and I predict the supporters of this illegitimate nominee will be screaming the loudest when they uncover the betrayal of everything they believe in by him and his minions.


by 07rescue on Sun Jun 01, 2008 at 06:36:20 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Just because your candidate lost.... (2.00 / 3)

Doesn't mean we all lose, unless we let the other side win.

I had to come to that conclusion after Edwards was done.

She had all of the early advantages. She ran a lousy race and lost to an unknown. Great campaigners don't do that.


by IowaMike on Sun Jun 01, 2008 at 11:46:49 AM EST

Re: Just because your candidate lost.... (2.00 / 2)

What the DNC has done goes beyond Obama or Clinton.
by zenful6219 on Sun Jun 01, 2008 at 11:49:09 AM EST
[ Parent ]

you're full of shit (1.30 / 10)

You are a HRC partisan.

Find me the neutral Democrat who is outraged at the compromise solution.


Rrrinnggg... Time to change the government.
by Carl Nyberg on Sun Jun 01, 2008 at 12:15:17 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: you're full of shit (1.75 / 4)

And you are a great example of a Obama "supporter"
by zenful6219 on Sun Jun 01, 2008 at 12:42:11 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: you're full of shit (1.50 / 6)

No amount of engaging you in civil discourse is going to change your mind.

And you will make dishonest arguments to encourage Clinton supporters to feel wronged.

Why are you entitled to my respect? And what does treating you respectfully get me?

Clinton supporters who float dishonest arguments to justify irrational anti-Obama emotions are trolls working for McCain at this point.

If you act like a troll, you will be treated like a troll.


Rrrinnggg... Time to change the government.
by Carl Nyberg on Sun Jun 01, 2008 at 01:09:11 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Just because your candidate lost.... (2.00 / 4)

You were just arguing yesterday that the Democratic Party erred by relying on voters TOO MUCH yesterday.  And then when the RBC decision came in, you reversed course and complained that they weren't relying enough on the voters.

Anything to guarantee a Clinton victory.  Salty language aside, Mssr. Nyborg is correct: you're neither honest nor objective.


I have that readiness.
by Jess81 on Sun Jun 01, 2008 at 01:21:27 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Is the Election Lost For The Democrats? (none / 0)

It all depends on you!


It profits a PUMA nothing to give their soul for the whole world... but for McCain? --Sir Thomas More (if he were here now)
by LordMike on Sun Jun 01, 2008 at 11:50:27 AM EST

Wrong. They didn't campaign. The primaries (1.60 / 5)

were NOT legitimate. They should have received ZERO.

As far as your bringing up slavery, this descendant of slaves says you can kiss his ass.


John McCain on social security.
by heresjohnny on Sun Jun 01, 2008 at 11:50:35 AM EST

Re: Wrong. They didn't campaign. The primaries (none / 0)

Preach it!


by sweet potato pie on Sun Jun 01, 2008 at 12:03:04 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Wrong. They didn't campaign. The primaries (none / 0)

Having read your comments here for a while now you are one of the reasons I will never support Obama and believe I must abandon by previously unwavering support for affirmative action and preferential admissions.

I never want you or anyone like to given an unfair advantage over my white childen, nieces or nephews.

This campaign has opened my eyes to the bigotry and race hatred prevelent among black folks. I never thought it was true but now I see it with my own eyes and reject it just like I have always rejected white racism.


by Caliman on Sun Jun 01, 2008 at 04:10:42 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Wrong. They didn't campaign. The primaries (none / 0)

Go fuck off.


ооо
by Mumphrey on Sun Jun 01, 2008 at 06:02:37 PM EST
[ Parent ]

BTW, Clinton started with 100 delegate lead (2.00 / 3)

from those "insiders" you think wanted to give the election to Obama from the start.


John McCain on social security.
by heresjohnny on Sun Jun 01, 2008 at 11:51:30 AM EST

Re: Is the Election Lost For The Democrats? (2.00 / 2)

Thanks for your CONCERN!


by authority song on Sun Jun 01, 2008 at 11:53:43 AM EST

Re: Is the Election Lost For The Democrats? (2.00 / 1)

You are most welcome. Thanks for reading.
by zenful6219 on Sun Jun 01, 2008 at 11:56:38 AM EST
[ Parent ]

as a florida voter, that's easy... (2.00 / 1)

we're thrilled -- thrilled -- at the outcome.  not only that, but the people i talked to yesterday were upset at hillary's campaign and their machinations, not the democratic party.  hillary opposed our party position and has used florida as her own personal whipping boy.  thankfully, democrats in florida are asking, how can we help the democratic nominee in our state?  what can we do to elect barack obama president.

i know that's not what you want to hear.  but that's what floridians in the all-critical i-4 corridor feel.  we probably don't count to you (anymore), but we're used to being dissed by the clinton democrats...


"Anyone who voted for me or caucused for me has so much more in common with Senator Obama than Senator McCain." -- Hillary Clinton
by bored now on Sun Jun 01, 2008 at 11:53:48 AM EST

Re: as a florida voter, that's easy... (2.00 / 1)

Wow. You are able to speak for all Floridians? Strange, there were several Floridians on television yesterday who didn't seem to be all that happy about the outcome. I Know...I Know...they're just crazy.
by zenful6219 on Sun Jun 01, 2008 at 11:59:06 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: as a florida voter, that's easy... (none / 0)

i must have missed that.  could you name any florida voter who is not happy with florida getting to go to the convention?  i'm stunned that you know of anyone from florida who's not happy about it!  in fact, i'm listening to bill nelson right now, and he says he's "happy with florida."  who are these unhappy floridians you speak of?


"Anyone who voted for me or caucused for me has so much more in common with Senator Obama than Senator McCain." -- Hillary Clinton
by bored now on Sun Jun 01, 2008 at 12:05:44 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: as a florida voter, that's easy... (none / 0)

So, you do speak for all Floridians?
by zenful6219 on Sun Jun 01, 2008 at 12:11:15 PM EST
[ Parent ]

strawman argument... (none / 0)

so who are these unhappy floridians you spoke of?  if they are florida pols or activists, i'll be happy to give them a call if it will ease your worried mind...


"Anyone who voted for me or caucused for me has so much more in common with Senator Obama than Senator McCain." -- Hillary Clinton
by bored now on Sun Jun 01, 2008 at 12:18:56 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Do you speak for any? (none / 0)

Or any Michigan voters for that matter?

If you aren't a resident of either of those states, then no you don't.


Check out McCain.
by you like it on Sun Jun 01, 2008 at 12:24:47 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: as a florida voter, that's easy... (none / 0)

Thanks go out to TexasDarlin for her link to this YouTube video.


by zenful6219 on Sun Jun 01, 2008 at 12:52:46 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: as a florida voter, that's easy... (none / 0)

did i miss the part where she said what you claimed floridians thought?  did you actually look at the video?

ftr, i accept at face value hillary's (and her supporter's) claim that she is closer to john mccain than she is to the democratic nominee.  i won't be surprised at all to see her as the vice-presidential nominee for mccain.  nor do i have any doubt that conservative democrats will follow her out of the party.  we won't be talking to this voter in the fall, we'll be talking to the absolute majority of voters who don't have a dogmatic position.  that's how you win.

like i said, florida voters are absolutely thrilled about getting seats in the convention.  if you have the names of any floridian who is unhappy with getting our seats back, feel free to let us know!


"Anyone who voted for me or caucused for me has so much more in common with Senator Obama than Senator McCain." -- Hillary Clinton
by bored now on Sun Jun 01, 2008 at 01:29:48 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: as a florida voter, that's easy... (none / 0)

where did Hillary state she is closer to John McCain in positions and policies?  or are you still harping on the CIC comment, in which Hillary has stated no one should vote for McCain?

really?


by colebiancardi on Sun Jun 01, 2008 at 02:03:41 PM EST
[ Parent ]

to be completely accurate... (none / 0)

it is hillary's supporters who claimed that she is closer to mccain than to obama.  i based including her in my comment based on her vote to invade iraq, her ardent defense of the presidential prerogative, etc -- things i think of as bush positions.  clumping them together isn't completely fair -- although i'll stand by them because of my own personal conversations with hillary through the years.  what i see, though, is that her ardent supporters are pushing her out of the democratic party (i guess we're too sexist for hillary and her supporters), and i don't see a way for her to wiggle her way out of that.  if that doesn't answer your question sufficiently, let me know.  i'm happy to discuss it...


"Anyone who voted for me or caucused for me has so much more in common with Senator Obama than Senator McCain." -- Hillary Clinton
by bored now on Sun Jun 01, 2008 at 05:32:45 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Is the Election Lost For The Democrats? (2.00 / 2)

If Ickes and that crazy Harriet Christian are your strongest evidence, then I'm not terribly afraid.


by rfahey22 on Sun Jun 01, 2008 at 11:53:51 AM EST

Re: Is the Election Lost For The Democrats? (2.00 / 3)

Florida and Michigan delegate votes being cut in half is now EQUAL to the struggle of African-Americans to achieve parity in this country.

Hoooooooookay, zenful6219. Glad to see you haven't lost any sense of perspective.


by Reeves on Sun Jun 01, 2008 at 11:58:07 AM EST

Re: Is the Election Lost For The Democrats? (2.00 / 1)

Who gave Harriet Christensen their own MyDD account? Welcome, Harriet!


by MJJLWolf on Sun Jun 01, 2008 at 12:02:01 PM EST

Re: Is the Election Lost For The Democrats? (none / 0)

What would the popular vote outcome and the delegate vote outcome be if The Delegates and the voters who supported Obama were 3/4th of the person.


by nkpolitics on Sun Jun 01, 2008 at 12:31:56 PM EST

What I have decided for myself... (1.66 / 3)

and your diary is right on...

I am 46 years old.  I have considered myself a Democrat since about 18 years old...even though my parents were solid republicans.

What I have decided after this past year, is that I am no longer a Democrat.

I am a gay, independent voter.  I will vote for who I like, and no one else.  I will not vote for whomever a party endorses.  My vote is my own, and no party, and no group of bloggers will influence my vote.

I am no longer a Democrat.


I am sick of the disrespect shown to Sen.Clinton by many on Dailykos, and now, too often, here. You aren't winning hearts and minds.
by SoCalVet on Sun Jun 01, 2008 at 12:36:01 PM EST

Re: What I have decided for myself... (2.00 / 2)

I don't think you are alone. Unfortunately, we won't know just how many of you there are until after the general election. But, by then, we may be watching President McCain's inauguration.
by zenful6219 on Sun Jun 01, 2008 at 12:45:09 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: What I have decided for myself... (2.00 / 2)

Harmed feelings and all, I never got what it was about HRC and the gays. I'm gay and honey she ain't no Judy Garland. She's more like Gloria Swanson at the end of Sunset Blvd.


by MJJLWolf on Sun Jun 01, 2008 at 12:46:56 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: What I have decided for myself... (1.00 / 2)

"I am no longer a Democrat"

Nor are you someone who cares about Supreme Court Justices, energy independence, soldiers dying in Iraq, healthcare, fiscal sanity,....

In other words, a fool.


by Reeves on Sun Jun 01, 2008 at 01:06:09 PM EST
[ Parent ]

For all the talk (1.00 / 5)

from the Hillary crowd of the woman being a fighter and a person of such strength and character, she seems to have thrust her supporters ito a realm of perpetual victimhood. And that's because she sets that bad example. She is probably the whiniest, pettiest and the most transparent politician that has come down the pike in quite sometime.

Yesterday has in essence sealed her fate. But I'm sure that her pathetic little hissy fits will continue to intrude on American politics.

At least it is clear now that the democratic party is no longer being hijacked by Bill and Hillary Clinton.


"Beauty, more than bitterness, makes the heart break." Sara Teasdale
by april34fff on Sun Jun 01, 2008 at 12:43:47 PM EST

Re: For all the talk (1.33 / 3)

And, Obama has thrust his supporters into a world of fantasy. The man is inadequate as a Presidential candidate.
by zenful6219 on Sun Jun 01, 2008 at 12:46:02 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: For all the talk (2.00 / 2)

more adequate than HIllary Clinton, apparently.


by BlueinColorado on Sun Jun 01, 2008 at 01:23:01 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: For all the talk (none / 0)

Time for a nice long retreat, then come back and work for the Democratic nominee.


by ReillyDiefenbach on Sun Jun 01, 2008 at 01:58:18 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: For all the talk (1.50 / 4)

It's now hijacked by Barack and Michelle Obama. Like I said in the diary, they're just a different kind of dirty.
by zenful6219 on Sun Jun 01, 2008 at 12:47:42 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Is the Election Lost For The Democrats? (2.00 / 2)

I live in MI.  This decision has not affected my level of faith in the party at all.  First off, I never imagined the democratic party to be some bastion of purity and morality.  It's a political party in a two-party system and for the most part comes for closer to advocating for the idea of a country and society I want to live in.  It's not a religious profession or institution, and those are always 'political' in morally ambiguous ways as well.  I have lost any faith in the leaders of the state party.  Granholm, Levin, Debbie Dingell, and their minions have acted AND CONTINUE to act irresponsibly and counter-productively.  I intend to support opponents of the first two in the next primary.


The future is unwritten
by Strummerson on Sun Jun 01, 2008 at 12:53:24 PM EST

Re: Is the Election Lost For The Democrats? (2.00 / 1)

I have a friend of 15 years who is from Detroit, and a life-long Democrat. He's so pissed off by the action in Michigan that he is changing his voter registration to Independent. He lives in Nevada now and, apparently, he has to do it in order to vote. So, not all Michigan natives are as thrilled as you about the outcome.
by zenful6219 on Sun Jun 01, 2008 at 01:01:40 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Is the Election Lost For The Democrats? (2.00 / 1)

He never stated he was "thrilled" with the results. But don't let that stop you from ignoring his post while stuffing words into his mouth. :^)


should we go outside? / should we break some bread? / are you'nterested?
by Firewall on Sun Jun 01, 2008 at 01:07:04 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Is the Election Lost For The Democrats? (1.00 / 2)

Whatever
by zenful6219 on Sun Jun 01, 2008 at 01:14:29 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Is the Election Lost For The Democrats? (none / 0)

Very compelling response.


The future is unwritten
by Strummerson on Sun Jun 01, 2008 at 01:56:56 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Is the Election Lost For The Democrats? (2.00 / 1)

I never said I was thrilled about the outcome.  My position has been that the local party leaders messed this up so bad there was no possible good outcome, just a fumbling attempt at the least unfair one.

I also never asserted that my position was representative of all MI democrats.  My diaries and comments on this site attest to my opposition to the Clinton campaign and their supporters who painted all MI democrats as homogenized victims in order to create the image of a moral cause to further a political one.  My position has always been that MI democrats are not in agreement and those of us not committed to HRC and her moralization of our predicament reject her configuration of our victimhood as baldly politically motivated.  Both candidates have every right and even a responsibility to fight for the most favorable outcome.  I object to the pretense that this was not a political fight, or that there was one clear moral and ethical side.  (I composed a diary on this subject and was informed by a Clinton supporting respondent that I "don't matter," though most Clinton supporters I actually know have treated my perspective with much more respect.)  

All Michigan democrats are victims, but not of HRC, BHO, or even the DNC and RBC, but of the irresponsible actions of our state leadership who did the most to create the impossible situation we have landed in.  My attitude towards yesterday's decision is that it is an odd and weird one structurally because it represents an attempt to create a fair compromise out of an ultimately unredeemable situation.  There were no proposed solutions I considered good, and have never written in support of any.  I therefore reject your characterization of my attitude as based on assumptions necessary for you to voice opposition.  I will be no one's straw man.  My point in this comment is that the culprits here are largely the local ones.  It is they who have lost my faith.


The future is unwritten
by Strummerson on Sun Jun 01, 2008 at 01:19:20 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Is the Election Lost For The Democrats? (2.00 / 1)

I found the commentary from the RBC members appalling.  It was a complete and utter joke.  Having superdelegates and those involved in campaigns make a decision that benefits or damages the campaigns, are you serious?  I find the comments of Harriet Christian and de Rothschild to be counterproductive along with that NC Super who called out Ickes.  It's no way to get a Democrat in office and making those statements about fellow Democrats is a travesty.


This administration is not sinking. This administration is soaring! If anything, they are rearranging the deck chairs on the Hindenburg!
by venavena on Sun Jun 01, 2008 at 01:04:49 PM EST

She lost. (none / 0)

She lost because she voted for Bush's war, and can't, or won't, take responsibility for that vote as the right or wrong thing to have done.

At least with Clinton we know exactly what kind of mud there is and that we can fling it and win.

This is hope, not a fact. I think you are wrong. I think McCain would've beat Clinton by a hundred EVs. I have as much evidence for that opinion as you do yours.


by BlueinColorado on Sun Jun 01, 2008 at 01:21:41 PM EST

Re: Obama: A different kind of dirty (none / 0)

Hey, you updated your diary with 50% more troll!  Congratulations!


by rfahey22 on Sun Jun 01, 2008 at 01:37:33 PM EST

heh, that Harriet quote ain't helping (2.00 / 1)

Got to love the "black" description thrown in.


by Slim Tyranny on Sun Jun 01, 2008 at 01:37:45 PM EST

By What Alchemy to Uncommiteds Become Obama's? (none / 0)

What the Rules Committee did yesterday stank to high heaven. The uncommitted supers on the committee were obviously stealth Obamites. It was crooked as hell and many Democrats and Independents will be mightily
offended. Yeah Obama plays dirty. Ask his opponents in 1996. Had them all stripped of their candidacys'
so he could run unopposed.
by hypopg on Sun Jun 01, 2008 at 03:55:25 PM EST


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